BRYN RIDGE

having been first duly sworn to speak the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, then testified as follows:

DIRECT EXAMINATION

BY MR. FOGLEMAN:

Q: Will you please state your name and occupation?

A: Detective Bryn Ridge. Detective for the West Memphis Police Department.

Q: I want to direct your attention to June third of 1993. On that date did you seek to obtain a Search Warrant from Municipal Judge Pal Rainey?

A: Yes, I did.

Q: I want to show you State's Exhibit One and ask if you can identify that?

A: (EXAMINING) It is the Affidavit of Search Warrant.

[000924]


Q: Did you sign that Affidavit?

A: Yes, I did.

Q: Did you sign it before Judge Rainey?

A: Yes, I did.

Q: Is that as to Damien Echols?

A: Yes.

Q: I'm going to show you State's Exhibit Three and ask if you can identify that?

A: (EXAMINING) Affidavit for Search Warrant.

Q: And how can you identify that?

A: It has my signature at the bottom.

Q: Did you sign that before Judge Rainey also?

A: Yes.

Q: In addition to the Affidavits for Search Warrant, did you provide oral recorded testimony before Judge Rainey?

A: Yes, I did.

MR. FOGLEMAN: Do you all want me to play the tape or use the transcript?

MR. WADLEY: Transcript is fine.

BY MR. FOGLEMAN:

Q: I want to show you State's Exhibit Five and ask if you can identify that?

A: (EXAMINING) It seems to be a transcript of the taped testimony given at the time the Affidavits were being sought.

Q: Did you and Inspector Gitchell provide some testimony under

[000925]


oath at the time the Affidavits for Search Warrants were presented to Judge Rainey?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And does -- is State's Exhibit Five a transcription of that tape recorded testimony?

A: Yes, sir.

MR. FOGLEMAN: We would offer State's Exhibit Five.

MR. PRICE: No objection.

(STATE'S EXHIBIT FIVE IS RECEIVED FOR PURPOSES OF THIS HEARING)

CROSS EXAMINATION

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: I'm looking at State's Exhibit Three. You have identified this. I ask you to refer to that if you would. Would it be fair to say that the items that you relied on to receive this Search Warrant from Judge Rainey was based upon Exhibit A contained in the Search Warrant? Is that correct? You see where I am referring to?

A: The front page of this Affidavit?

Q: Yes.

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You relied on that?

A: Yes.

Q: As a basis for the Search Warrant?

[000926]


A: Yes.

Q: You relied on Exhibit B, which tell me if I'm wrong, is a statement of Mr. Misskelley and a statement of a gentleman by the name of William Jones?

A: That's correct.

Q: And you also as a basis for the issuance of a finding of reasonable cause to search the residence of Jason Baldwin -- you refer to Exhibit C on the Search Warrant. Is that correct?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And what does Exhibit C contain?

A: Exhibit C appears to be the body of Charles Jason Baldwin, also some specific items.

Q: Any other evidence -- any other documents -- any other anything -- did you rely on anything else other than these three things contained in your affidavit -- anything else you relied on when you were in front of Judge Pal Rainey to seek this Search Warrant for the trailer of Jason Baldwin?

A: What do you want? What are the items?

Q: Did you rely on anything else -- you say in your Affidavit you rely on Exhibit A, B and C to get the Search Warrant. Is there anything else you relied on when you were in front of the judge to get the Search Warrant to search Jason Baldwin's trailer?

A: The investigation itself.

Q: The investigation itself. What are you referring to?

[000927]


A: The totality of information that I received during the course of this investigation.

Q: Was that presented to Judge Rainey?

A: No, sir. This information and the taped interview during the course of obtaining this Affidavit.

Q: Other than the statements contained in the statements -- the recorded statements you made to Judge Rainey and Exhibits A, B and c -- there's nothing else you relied on in getting the Search Warrant?

A: That's right.

Q: There's nothing else relied on in Exhibits A, B and C and recorded statements you made to Judge Rainey for the purpose of obtaining a Search Warrant after 8:00 p.m. Is that correct?

A: The information received during this investigation.

Q: Other than these three exhibits and other than the recorded statement you made to Judge Rainey, there's nothing else you relied upon in obtaining a nighttime search of the trailer of Jason Baldwin? Is that right?

A: Yes, sir. The information we received from witnesses.

Q: We will go into that in just a minute. Tell me this, officer. When was the first time that you visited with Jessie Misskelley concerning a statement?

A: The first time would have been June third.

Q: Any other statements taken from him?

A: No.

[000928]


Q: None after that?

A: No.

Q: So it will be fair to say that there were no other statements other than the first statement you took from Mr. Misskelley and the second statement you took from him -- there was nothing else presented to Judge Rainey as a result of Mr. Misskelley's statements?

A: At that particular time, yes, sir.

Q: When you say, "at that particular time," how many other times --

A: He was interviewed once before but not by me.

Q: You are the one that made application for the search?

A: That's correct.

Q: Anything contained in that interview with Mr. Misskelley -- those items were not
presented to Judge Rainey?

A: That's correct.

Q: Tell me the first time you met with Judge Rainey concerning the issuance
of this Search Warrant.

A: The evening of June third.

Q: What time did you meet with him the first time?

A: I'm not exactly sure. It was in the afternoon hours.

Q: Could you get within 30 minutes?

A: It may be documented somewhere but I don't have it on my mind.

Q: Was it before five o'clock or after?

[000929]


A: I'm not certain.

Q: You just don't have any idea?

A: I'm not certain of the time. I was up until four o'clock the next morning.

Q: So you -- was it before lunch or after lunch?

A: After lunch.

Q: You met with Judge Rainey. Did you meet with him on a subsequent occasion on the third?

A: On the third.

Q: Yes, sir.

A: Met with him when we were preparing the Affidavit for Search Warrant.

Q: Let me show you what -- I will show you State's Exhibit Four. You have already
identified that. It shows on here the time you were in front of Judge Rainey was at 9:50 p.m. Is that correct?

A: Yes, sir, that is what it shows.

Q: Is that the first time you met with him that day concerning the issuance of this Search Warrant?

A: Maybe met with him prior to that, just a few hours prior to.

Q: Where would that meeting have occurred?

A: It would have been in our office at the police department.

Q: At your office in the police department?

A: At the office in the police department. It could have been

[000930]


in the Court Clerk's office or in the office at the police department.

Q: Do you recall why you met him earlier in the day?

A: Why I met with him?

Q: Yes, sir.

A: He was assisting in preparing the Search Warrant and Affidavit.

Q: Judge Rainey was assisting in preparing the Search Warrant Affidavit. Is that what you're telling me?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: How was he assisting you in preparing a Search Warrant Affidavit?

A: He was informing us as to the elements that needed to go in this Affidavit in order for it to be a legal document.

Q: So you met with him and then he was telling you how to fill it out?

A: He was telling us what the elements needed to be in order for this to be a legal document.

Q: What did he tell you?

A: He told us what elements needed to be in the document.

Q: What elements are those?

A: Those elements that are there.

Q: Did he tell you, "You need to have this and this and this?"

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And then did you proceed to go out and get this, this and

[000931]


this -- those items he told you you needed to get?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: So he told you what you needed to get and you went out and came back and met with Judge Rainey?

A: Yes.

Q: Where did you meet at?

A: In the Court Clerk's office.

Q: In West Memphis?

A: Municipal Court.

Q: Who was present?

A: Myself, John Fogleman, Gary Gitchell, Jimbo Hale, and the Court Clerk.

THE COURT: Were you put under oath and did you give testimony before the Court at that time?

THE WITNESS: Yes, I did.

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: Let me show you -- when you met with Judge Rainey at 9:50 p.m. on the third, it would be fair to say that Judge Rainey had some concerns about some discrepancies in the initial statement of Mr. Misskelley?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: In fact he talked to you about that?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And in fact Mr. Fogleman asked you some questions about that?

[000932]


A: Yes, sir.

Q: It is fair to say he talked with you about some corroboration?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Judge Rainey asked you about his concerns. In his words, "obvious discrepancies?"

A: Yes, sir.

Q: one of those obvious discrepancies was to the time that these homicides occurred?

A: That's correct.

Q: And you had met at another time with Mr. Misskelley?

A: The second interview was not done by me. The second interview to clear up the discrepancies was done by Mr. Gitchell.

Q: Were you present?

A: No.

Q: Do you know the time that was done?

A: I don't have the time with me.

Q: Mr. Fogleman asked you about some corroboration in the Affidavits concerning statements by Mr. Misskelley. Did you tell Mr. Fogleman under oath that the testicles and the penis of one of the boys had been completely removed?

A: I told him they had been removed?

Q: And that is not correct?

A: Excuse me?

[000933]


Q: You know that not to be correct, don't you.

A: To my knowledge, that is correct.

Q: The penis was completely removed from the body of one of the victims?

A: The penis was removed. Yes, sir.

Q: It is your sworn testimony today that you didn't know that when you were in front of Judge Rainey?

A: Yes, sir, I knew that.

Q: It was your sworn testimony that they were completely removed -- both the testicles and the penis?

A: The penis was removed from one of the boys. I understand that.

Q: That's still your understanding?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And you also stated that you had -- did you get that information from the State Crime Lab?

A: I saw it myself at the crime scene.

Q: It is your testimony -- and I don't want to belabor this -- that the penis was entirely removed?

A: To my knowledge. A medical term may be different from that. To my knowledge, the penis was removed.

Q: Did the State Crime Lab tell you that had been done?

A: The penis had been removed and the wording is something like, "the scrotum had been scraped," but the penis had been removed. That is to my knowledge.

[000934]


Q: You would agree with me Judge Rainey had some serious, serious concerns about discrepancies in Mr. Misskelley's statement at the time he was to issue this Search Warrant?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Isn't it true that you were familiar -- and you had read the statement -- the second statement of Mr. Misskelley when you were in front of Judge Rainey at approximately 9:50 p.m.?

A: No, sir, I hadn't read it yet.

Q: You had not read that?

A: No, sir.

Q: Have you read it subsequent to then?

A: Yes, sir, I have read it.

Q: You're aware then that in the second statement --

MR. FOGLEMAN: Your Honor, Detective Gitchell who Detective Ridge said took that statement is here, and I think he would be the appropriate person to testify about that.

MR. WADLEY: Judge, I can ask him -- I can certainly go --

THE COURT: Ask him if he read it or if he's familiar with the contents of it. Is that what you want to ask him?

MR. WADLEY: I've asked him, and he said he is, Judge.

THE COURT: All right. Go ahead.

[000935]


BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: You're familiar with it?

A: With the second statement?

Q: Yes, sir.

A: What was told to me at that point. Yes, sir.

Q: Have you read the second statement?

A: Yes.

Q: When did you read it?

A: Sometime after the arrests were made.

Q: Prior to being in front of Judge Rainey, did Mr. Gitchell tell you what was in the second warrant concerning the materials use to tie the boys up -- what Mr. Misskelley said?

A: I don't know that that was specifically covered. No, sir.

Q: Isn't it true that Mr. Gitchell told you that Misskelley stated they were tied up with a brown rope?

A: I'm not certain if that's what Mr. Gitchell told me or not.

Q: He may have told you that?

A: He may have. Yes, sir.

Q: You know, don't you, that that is not in fact what happened, correct?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You knew that when you were in front of Judge Rainey, didn't you?

A: Yes, sir.

MR. STIDHAM: Judge, may counsel approach the

[000936]


bench?

THE COURT: Yes.

(THE FOLLOWING CONFERENCE TOOK PLACE AT THE BENCH)

MR. STIDHAM: We're getting off the course of the Affidavits being merely in the Court's presence. We've got dozens of members of the media out there who are writing all this information down, and I suspect it will be in the papers and on TV tonight and tomorrow. This is highly prejudicial to Mr. Misskelley.

THE COURT: What are you getting at?

MR. WADLEY: This goes to the veracity and the officer's knowledge of what was going on when he was in front of the judge seeking a Search Warrant to go search someone's house. I think it's proper --

MR. STIDHAM: I'm not saying --

MR. FOGLEMAN: If Detective Ridge had lied to the judge or something about something, that's one thing -- but if he --

THE COURT: I think you need to go into it through Detective Gitchell.

MR. STIDHAM: These are sealed documents. I'm not arguing that he shouldn't go into it. I'm arguing that we should do this in camera because these things

[000937]


we are discussing now are under seal. The Affidavit's been sealed to my understanding, and we're talking about specific allegations, and I know the Commercial Appeal printed it on the front page of the newspaper, but Judge we're going to be going through this again on --

THE COURT: I'm not going to enter a gag order or try this thing in a void. They've got a right to be here.

MR. STIDHAM: On this particular issue, Judge, I think it's prejudicial.

THE COURT: No. Overruled.

MR. FOGLEMAN: Judge, my only objection to what he's doing is is that if there's some fact he says in the Affidavit is a misrepresentation or is just flat out not true, I have no objection to him asking about that, but just asking about stuff that's not misrep -- I mean he's asking about -- the thing about the rope and the shoestring. That's not addressed in the Affidavit for Search Warrant.

MR. WADLEY: All I'm saying is I'm asking questions to this effect is that --

THE COURT: I'm going to view the search warrant from its four corners including the testimony that was given to the judge, and that was the basis for his

[000938]


issuance of the Search Warrant, and really that's the only thing that is pertinent.

MR. STIDHAM: Judge, this is highly prejudicial --

MR. WADLEY: -- this is certainly a relevant factor in determining whether there was a good faith basis for him to issue the Search Warrant.

THE COURT: Okay. If you want to ask him for that purpose.

(RETURN TO OPEN COURT)

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: Detective Ridge, on the third day of June of this year did you have a conversation with anyone at the State Crime Lab in Little Rock?

MR. FOGLEMAN: What was that date?

MR. WADLEY: The third.

BY THE WITNESS:

A: I didn't, no.

Q: Do you know anyone that did have conversations with anyone at the Crime Lab?

A: To my knowledge, Detective Gitchell did.

Q: He talked to some folks down there?

A: Yes.

Q: Were you present when he made a phone call to them?

A: I was aware he made a phone call, but I don't think I was

[000939]


present.

Q: When did you first become aware that he had made a phone call?

A: Sometime after I was preparing this information.

Q: Which would have been when?

A: Sometime in the afternoon hours.

Q: So it would be fair to say that you never talked to anyone with the Crime Lab on the third prior to them coming to Marion?

A: Yes.

THE COURT: Did you obtain information from a fellow investigative officer about results from the Crime Lab?

THE WITNESS: Yes, sir.

THE COURT: Are you maintaining there's something wrong with that?

MR. WADLEY: No, your Honor. I'm laying a foundation for later testimony.

THE COURT: Go ahead.

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: In Exhibit C would you pull out the items that were taken from Mr. Baldwin's trailer?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Let me first ask you, Officer, in Exhibit C you refer to on the items that you want to remove from the trailer of Jason Baldwin -- you refer to "cult materials" and then in parentheses

[000940]


you have "satanic materials?"

A: Yes, sir.

Q: First thing I want to ask you is describe for me what cult materials are.

A: As a definition a cult material as a cult would be a group, and the cult materials would be any kind of groups with symbolism, writings, paraphernalia that would agree with that cult.

Q: Be specific. What are you talking about? You have "cult materials" and then in parentheses you have "satanic materials." Are you talking about specific items?

A: Books, reading materials, drawings, knives, anything of that nature.

Q: Was there anything in the statement of Mr. Misskelley which gave you reasonable cause to believe that satanic materials would be found in the trailer of Jason Baldwin?

A: That it was part of a satanic cult.

Q: I'm talking about Jason Baldwin. I'm not talking about Mr. Misskelley. I am talking about Jason Baldwin.

A: Just what Jessie Misskelley has told us?

Q: In the Affidavit that you have attached for the issuance of a Search Warrant, I want you to tell me what he told you for the issuance of a Search Warrant for cult materials.

A: Just that he had been part of a cult activity.

Q: That Mr. Misskelley had, correct?

[000941]


A: And that Jason had.

Q: Where in the statement do you ask him that question?

A: Well, I will have to look through it, but it is part of the total investigation.

Q: You have attached exhibits when you to to this judge and say, "I want a Search Warrant to search the house of Jason Baldwin," and you give him information to make a basis to issue that warrant. I'm asking you where in the statement of Misskelley does it talk about Jason Baldwin giving rise to finding materials in his house or trailer?

A: I will have to read the whole statement.

Q: Read it.

MR. FOGLEMAN: My only objection to this question is Mr. Wadley is asking him to look at one part of the Affidavit and not taking into consideration other parts of the Affidavit, and based on that we object to the form of that question.

MR. WADLEY: Your Honor, there are three exhibits attached as a basis for their Affidavit, and there are some questions asked by Judge Rainey and asked by Mr. Fogleman to Detective Ridge, and I am asking him with respect to the Affidavits -- A, B and C -- on the Affidavit for Search Warrant where that language is that Mr. Misskelley stated that Jason Baldwin had cult materials in his house.

[000942]


BY THE WITNESS:

A: The taped interview does describe the investigation having pointed to cult activities and Jason Baldwin and Damien Echols being a part of that.

Q: The taped interview?

A: Yes.

Q: Where -- which one are you talking about?

A: The testimony given in front of Rainey that evening.

Q: Did you have a transcript of that tape that you gave to Judge Rainey?

A: Yes, it was done.

Q: I'm saying -- did you give any -- the recordings of Mr. Misskelley that you gave to him that evening?

A: No, sir. The recordings of the investigation what showed that it was a satanic group or a cult.

Q: Do you have that information with you?

A: I think it is in that interview right there.

Q: Did you present those things individually? Do they contain what people had told you?

A: Yes, sir. Contains elements of the investigation up to that point.

Q: Officer, in your statement that you made to Judge Rainey you say you made -- you get that information from somewhere, don't you?

A: Yes, sir.

[000943]


Q: You get that from what people have told you?

A: Partly what Jessie has told me, yes.

Q: Tell me in either statement -- first of all, show me in Mr. Misskelley's statement where a question was asked of him -- that you asked him -- is Jason Baldwin involved in any cult activity.

A: It's not in the taped interview. It was in the interview before the tape began.

Q: You will agree with me it is not contained in Exhibit B that you presented to Judge Rainey, right?

A: I'm not certain. I would have to read through it.

Q: Read it.

A: (EXAMINING)

Q: Can you point to anything in the statement of Mr. Misskelley where he said that Jason Baldwin was a member of the cult?

THE COURT: Pages twenty-four, twenty-five and twenty-six.

BY THE WITNESS:

A: He refers to the cult activities on the pages that the judge pointed out.

Q: He refers to cult activities, doesn't he.

A: Yes, sir.

MR. FOGLEMAN: Your Honor, if Detective Ridge could be given permission to answer the question without Mr. Wadley interrupting him and allow him to

[000944]


finish the answer.

MR. WADLEY: Judge, I'm not meaning to do that.

THE COURT: All right. Go ahead. Were you through?

THE WITNESS: Yes, sir.

THE COURT: Go ahead.

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: Fact of the matter is he refers to cult activities, doesn't he.

A: Yes, sir.

Q: But he never makes any reference to Jason Baldwin, does he.

A: In this statement, no, sir.

Q: He does not, does he.

A: No, sir.

Q: In the second statement that you had -- the follow-up statement of Mr. Misskelley -- he makes no reference of anything to do with anything concerning Jason Baldwin and cult activities, does he.

A: I don't have that statement in front of me. I don't know. I didn't take the statement.

Q: Were you present when it was taken?

A: No, sir.

Q: In the Affidavit contained in your Exhibit B to the Search Warrant, more specifically, the statement of a gentleman by the name of William Winfred Jones. Are you familiar with that?

[000945]


A: Yes, sir.

Q: You took his statement?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: It is also fair to say that he never made a statement that Jason Baldwin was involved in any cult activities, did he?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You agree with me?

A: Yes, sir, I agree with you.

Q: He never made that reference?

A: No.

Q: And the Affidavits of any other person that you may have talked to in the community -- those Affidavits were not presented to Judge Rainey when he was doing the taped statement, were they?

A: No.

Q: If you will refer to Exhibit C and refer to the items taken from the house, or the trailer, excuse me. Is it fair to say that Mr. Misskelley told you in his statement that when this event occurred that Mr. Baldwin was wearing a black tee shirt. Is that right?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: There was some confusion as to whether or not he was wearing a tee shirt that had a name written on it, either Metallica or Megadeath?

A: Yes, sir.

[000946]


Q: It was one of those two, right?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And then as to the pants that Mr. Misskelley says Mr. Baldwin was wearing, he described those pants as being some blue jeans with holes in them. Is that correct?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: It is also fair to say that you never asked Mr. Misskelley if he had ever been in the trailer of Jason Baldwin? Isn't that fair to say?

A: I don't remember asking him that. No, sir.

Q: As a matter of fact, there's nothing contained in any statement that you have taken from Mr. Misskelley that he ever saw any of those items that you took out of Mr. Baldwin's house located in Mr. Baldwin's trailer. Isn't that fair to say?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Isn't it fair to say that in the statement of Mr. Misskelley he makes reference to a briefcase and some other contents with pictures in it. Is that right?

A: Yes.

Q: He never ever says -- he never makes a statement that these items were ever in the possession of Jason Baldwin, does he?

A: I don't think so. No, sir.

Q: Based upon that statement there was no reason to believe that those photographs would be found in Mr. Baldwin's trailer, is there.

[000947]


MR. FOGLEMAN: Your Honor --

THE COURT: This question is argumentative and I'll sustain the objection.

MR. WADLEY: Your Honor, I -- I will ask it a different way.

MR. FOGLEMAN: Your Honor, before he continues this, the law is clear that the Search Warrant and Affidavit are to be judged from its four corners and most of the questions go to what is in the Affidavit, and the Court can look at it and see whether or not there is a problem with it. If there is something that is in the Affidavit that Mr. Wadley is saying is incorrect, I won't have any objection to that, but this is just a waste of time.

MR. WADLEY: Your Honor, I'm allowed --

THE COURT: Go ahead.

MR. WADLEY: Are you denying his objection?

THE COURT: Yes. Y'all both are just making statements. Go ahead.

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: Do you have any factual basis to support when you went to Judge Rainey reasonable cause to believe that a briefcase with photographs would be found in his trailer?

MR. FOGLEMAN: Object to argumentative.

THE COURT: That is a question the Court is going

[000948]


to have to determine based upon the totality of the Affidavit and information submitted to Judge Rainey at the time.

MR. WADLEY: Judge, he's the one who made application for a warrant. I think I can ask him --

THE COURT: If you're asking him the question, "Did you believe you had probable cause," I think he can probably answer that because that is essentially what you're asking him.

MR. WADLEY: I'll ask it a different way, Judge.

THE COURT: All right.

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: There's nothing that Mr. Misskelley told you in any of the statements that photographs were ever located or briefcases were ever located in the trailer of Mr. Baldwin?

A: No, sir. He didn't know where they were.

Q: Exhibit C, page two of two, it makes reference to blue green, red, black, purple fibers. Number two makes reference to blue, yellow, read, paint or plastic residue, red waxy type substance. In any of the Affidavits that you presented to Judge Rainey to seek the seizure of these items, what Affidavit did you use to support a request to the municipal judge to seek seizure of these fibers?

A: Just that evidence was collected at the crime scene and we were looking for evidence that matched that evidence at the

[000949]


crime scene.

Q: You had no reason to believe that any of this stuff was at the crime scene, did you, when you made application for the Search Warrant?

A: Yes, sir, I did.

Q: What was that based upon?

A: The information received by me from Inspector Gitchell.

Q: Did you receive this information from the Crime Lab?

A: He did.

Q: And you never talked to anyone down there, correct?

A: Yes, sir, I have talked with them in the past.

Q: Did you talk to Lisa Sakevicius?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You didn't talk to her that day?

A: Inspector Gitchell got that information.

Q: Anything in any of the Affidavits that you presented or anything you presented to Judge Rainey that he reviewed for the issuance of this Search Warrant said there was reason to believe these fibers would be found in the trailer of Mr. Baldwin?

A: The black fibers obviously could have come from the tee shirt.

Q: What else?

A: Any of these fibers which are known as trace evidence could have been found on the body as transferred from the residence of Mr. Baldwin.

[000950]


Q: Is it fair to say that you could find these type of fibers in any house in America?

A: I guess it is possible.

Q: If you own something blue, green, red, black and purple -- most people own colors like that -- something made out of that, would you agree?

A: Yes.

Q: The question was is there anything that you presented Judge Rainey where you had reason to believe that these would be located in the trailer of Mr. Baldwin?

A: I don't understand how you're asking the question.

MR. FOGLEMAN: The Affidavit is there before the Court. The recorded testimony is there before the Court. I'm making an objection based on a waste of time, what we're doing, going through all this. If Mr. Wadley wants to make an argument to the Court that there's no basis in the Affidavit for searching for fibers, fine. He can make that argument.

MR. WADLEY: I've asked him -- I can certainly ask --

THE COURT: You have asked him. Let's move along.

MR. WADLEY: I don't believe he's answered, Judge.

BY MR. WADLEY:

[000951]


Q: Would it be fair to say that you went in there to get these fibers hoping that you might find something? You didn't know if they might be there or you were hoping you might find something?

A: That also. Yes, sir.

Q: Did you have a conversation with Lisa Sakevicius that evening when you were at the trailer?

A: Which one?

Q: At Mr. Baldwin's trailer.

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Isn't it true that she told you that she didn't expect to find anything?

MR. FOGLEMAN: Your Honor, that's hearsay. She's here and she can testify.

MR. FORD: This is a preliminary matter, too.

THE COURT: Sustained.

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: In your Exhibit C you asked to take a black tee shirt and blue jeans with holes in the knees?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Do you know how many blue jeans you took from his residence that had holes in the knees?

A: With holes in the knees, I don't think we found any.

Q: You took a bunch of blue jeans out of there?

A: Ah, I kept two pair of jeans.

Q: Neither of them had holes in the knees, correct?

[000952]


A: Yes, sir.

Q: The Affidavit you asked for -- you specifically asked for blue jeans with holes in the knees?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You took items out of the trailer that you didn't even get a Search Warrant to take, didn't you?

A: Took items after getting fiber samples from those items, yes, sir.

Q: Same thing with the tee shirt. You took about 17 tee shirts?

A: Fifteen black tee shirts and one white tee shirt.

Q: And the items that you took shows here a poem on a piece of paper. Is that one of the items you considered to be a cult or satanic items?

A: It was questionable in nature. I left that to somebody more learned in the field.

Q: You didn't know but you went ahead and took it anyway?

A: That's correct.

Q: You also asked Judge Rainey in your Affidavit and also in your sworn testimony in front of Judge Rainey that you were requesting a nighttime search of Mr. Baldwin's trailer?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: What written Affidavits of possible suspects or witnesses that you had interviewed -- what written Affidavit did you provide to the judge -- Judge Rainey that Jason Baldwin was a

[000953]


member of a close knit cult group?

A: The testimony that I gave him concerning the investigation.

Q: What written Affidavits either from a witness or defendant or suspect did you give to Judge Rainey concerning or supporting your contention that these gentlemen were members of a close knit cult group?

A: Written documents, none.

Q: When you have a case involving homicide and you have got multiple suspects or defendants, would not it be fair to say it is your policy that you want to do a nighttime search in those type situations?

A: That I would want to?

Q: Yes, sir.

A: No, sir.

Q: If the defendants or suspects know one another and it is a homicide case -- any homicide case -- it is your policy that you want a nighttime search in those situations?

A: No, sir.

Q: It is not?

A: No, sir.

Q: You gave two bases to support a search of Mr. Baldwin's trailer after 8:00 p.m.

A: Yes, sir.

Q: One of them was that the boys are close knit cult members?

A: Yes, sir.

[000954]


Q: You also gave a reason for that is that, "We know they are very close and when they discover the one we have now is missing from the group, they'll very likely destroy any evidence." Is that correct?

A: Yes.

Q: Those are the only two bases, correct?

A: Yes.

Q: There's nothing that you presented to Judge Rainey based upon any Affidavits from any person, other than one, that these defendants even knew each other?

A: That I presented to him?

Q: Yes.

A: To my knowledge, knowing that they were a close knit group of a satanic cult.

Q: I'm not talking about your knowledge. I'm talking about what you presented to the judge.

A: I presented my knowledge.

Q: How did this knowledge come to be? Did you get it in a dream?

A: No, sir. Through the investigation.

Q: Those investigations are based upon talking to people?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You talked to them and you write down their statement or more importantly you have them write it down and sign it?

A: Yes, sir.

[000955]


Q: You didn't present evidence about being close friends, did you, that were written down?

A: I presented my testimony knowing that those statements existed.

Q: You didn't present them to the judge?

A: I presented my statement.

Q: Based on what somebody else told you?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: In Exhibit C what was your basis for looking for these particular colors?

A: The Crime Lab had relayed that these items were of interest in the recovered fibers and evidence on the bodies.

Q: The Crime Lab didn't relay to you that they had reason to believe they might be located in Mr. Baldwin's trailer, did they?

A: No, sir.

Q: Was that related to you or Mr. Gitchell?

A: Mr. Gitchell.

CROSS EXAMINATION

BY MR. PRICE:

Q: Detective Ridge, the statement that was taped which Mr. Misskelley gave -- the first statement -- began at 2:44 p.m.?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: The rights form itself that was preceded by this particular statement -- are you aware that that rights form was signed at

[000956]


11:00 a.m.?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Between 11:00 a.m. and 2:44 p.m. did you or Detective Gitchell talk to Mr. Misskelley?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Is that approximately three hours and forty-five minutes? Do you have written notes concerning that conversation?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Have those been made available to Mr. Fogleman?

A: Yes.

Q: The discovery process has been on-going. Do you know when those notes were made available to Mr. Fogleman?

A: I don't have the documents with me. I do have them at the office and they are dated.

Q: We got a batch of stuff in July and August and some in September. Do you know approximately when your notes were given to Mr. Fogleman?

A: Should have been the first batch of notes that you received.

Q: I believe you testified earlier the second statement that was conducted was to clarify the previous statement that was done by Detective Gitchell?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: You were not present?

A: No, sir.

[000957]


Q: Prior to that statement being recorded, did Detective Gitchell talk to Mr. Misskelley in between the previous recorded statement and the second recorded statement?

A: No that I'm aware of. I wasn't there.

Q: I believe the first statement -- the one that started at 2:44 ended at 3:18?

A: I think that sounds right. Yes, sir.

Q: Moving back on the first statement -- the one that you were present at -- at the time approximately around 2:20, 2:44, Mr. Misskelley began to break down and cry?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: I believe there's some references in your notes that you gave Mr. Misskelley some time to compose himself?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Also at the same time did you being to cry also?

A: Yes, sir, I did.

Q: I believe the notes indicated you also needed some time to compose yourself due to the emotional situation?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: As far as the items you were requesting to be received from Mr. Echols' house -- you did not have reason to believe that any of the objects to be seized were in danger of imminent removal, did you?

A: In my judgment, yes, sir.

Q: The items that you were searching for were black pants of

[000958]


Mr. Echols?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And also black boots?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And I believe there was a briefcase with some material in that?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And some knives?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And the items of trace evidence and I think those were as a matter of fact the exact items Mr. Wadley mentioned earlier, fibers and plastics and some red waxy substance?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: As a matter of fact, Exhibit C was attached to both defendants' exhibits?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Besides that y'all were also searching for cult materials and in parentheses satanic materials and a belt?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: It is your position that those items were in danger of being imminently removed?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Those are clothing items?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: The location of the Echols' residence -- it was not

[000959]


difficult to get to that residence, was it?

A: No, sir.

Q: Y'all had been surveying that residence for a certain period of time?

A: I don't know of any surveillance.

Q: Attached to the Search Warrant Affidavit was a photograph of Mr. Echols' house?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Was that a photograph that you took or another officer took?

A: The copy I have here shows the residence of Domini Teer. If this is the correct Search Warrant, the wrong picture has been attached. There were four Search Warrants. There was one Search Warrant, Damien Wayne Echols, for his residence at -- in West Memphis -- and the second Search Warrant for a place where he was staying in Lakeshore which is Domini Teer's residence.

Q: As far as the location of Mr. Echols' home, would you say that would it be difficult to predict with accuracy how successful you may have been with that Search Warrant?

A: Evidence was found at the scene that was seized.

Q: What y'all go there was rather easy to get?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: As a matter of fact attached on the return are all the items that were recovered at the Echols' house.

A: Yes, sir.

[000960]


REDIRECT EXAMINATION

BY MR. FOGLEMAN:

Q: Detective Ridge, when you're talking about first and second taped statements, are you talking about recorded statements?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Was there a time -- and I think Mr. Price alluded to it -- where you and another detective talked to Mr. Misskelley when you were just interviewing him?

A: Yes, sir, twice.

Q: Who was the other investigator?

A: Mike Allen began the interview in which the general information was gotten and Jessie's statement as to what the flow of events were that day.

Q: Are these your notes from that interview?

A: (EXAMINING) Yes, sir.

Q: Mr. Wadley was asking you some questions about this cult and all that. Did Mr. Misskelley tell you -- give you a list of names of the people that participated in that cult?

A: Yes.

Q: Of the list that he gave you, if you would just -- who were the first three?

A: Jessie, Jason and Damien.

Q: That was prior to the tape recorded statement that's attached to the Affidavit?

A: Yes, sir.

[000961]


Q: In the tape recorded statement that is attached to the Affidavit, did he talk more about those cult type activities?

A: Yes.

Q: Did he refer to a photograph of the victims that he saw at one of these cult type meetings?

A: Yes, sir.

MR. WADLEY: Object to leading.

THE COURT: Avoid leading.

BY MR. FOGLEMAN:

Q: Is there something to that effect in the Affidavit -- in the recorded testimony?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: In the statement of Mr. Jones that is attached to the Affidavit, if you would refer to that. I will withdraw that. The Court's got that.

THE COURT: The Court is aware of what it says.

BY MR. FOGLEMAN:

Q: In regard to -- in the recorded testimony before Judge Rainey here in the recorded testimony where you said it is a close knit group of cult members and you say verified by other members of the community. Did you have other witness statements in your file that backed you up in what you said there?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Approximately how many other statements?

A: Six.

[000962]


Q: At the time you requested this Search Warrant from Judge Rainey, was one of those members in your custody?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: And that was Jessie Misskelley?

A: That's correct.

Q: On the issue of what happened that day, after Mr. Misskelley made the statement that is attached to the Affidavit for Search Warrant, was it at that time when y'all decided to seek a Search Warrant?

A: Yes.

Q: Who did y'all consult in the preparation of the Affidavit?

A: You and Jimbo Hale.

Q: In fact I was down here in a murder trial?

A: Yes, sir.

Q: Where was the Affidavit prepared?

A: In my office at the police department.

Q: In the course of preparing -- had the tape recording already been transcribed when we first started preparing the Affidavit?

A: No, sir, it was still being transcribed.

Q: Do you recall approximately how much time was spent in preparing the Affidavits for Search Warrant?

A: Probably at least two hours.

Q: During the course of the preparation of the Affidavit for Search Warrant, was there other activity going on?

[000963]


A: Yes, sir.

Q: What was about to happen?

A: We were seeking arrest warrants for the defendants. We were trying to contact the Crime Lab to get representatives from there to help in the collecting of evidence. We were trying to get the wording of the Affidavits in correct and proper order. Just a little bit of everything was going on during that period of time.

RECROSS EXAMINATION

BY MR. PRICE:

Q: You did not obtain permission from Jessie Misskelley, Senior, to talk to Jessie Misskelley, Junior, did you?

A: As far as I know, yes, sir.

Q: Was that done by written permission?

A: Mike Allen would have to answer that question.

Q: As far as -- you're not aware of any written document that you would have had Mr. Misskelley, Senior to sign granting permission for y'all to talk to his son?

A: The document was signed in order for a test to be performed.

Q: A physical test of some type?

A: Excuse me?

Q: Y'all had Mr. Misskelley, Senior, sign a consent to search form?

A: Yes, sir.

[000964]


Q: Did you obtain written permission from Jessie Misskelley, Senior, to talk to Jessie Misskelley, Junior?

A: I did not.

Q: Do you know of anyone in the department that did?

A: I'm not certain.

RECROSS EXAMINATION

BY MR. WADLEY:

Q: How long had Mr. Misskelley been in custody or not free to go his own way before you went to the trailer of Mr. Baldwin?

A: He had been in custody since the conclusion of the interview which would have been 3:18 and whatever time we made it to the trailer of Jason Baldwin.

Q: How long had he been at the police station prior to concluding the statement?

A: I don't have the documentation in front of me, but I think it was mentioned 11:00 that morning.

Q: When did you make a search of the Baldwin trailer?

A: I don't have the documentation with me, but it was later that same night, right at midnight or just before.

Q: So from 11:00 to midnight Mr. Misskelley had been in custody. Is that right?

A: Yes, sir.

(WITNESS EXCUSED)

GARY GITCHELL

having been first duly sworn to speak the truth, the whole truth

[000965]